Ideas Have Consequences
Everything that we see around us is the product of ideas, of ideologies, of worldviews. That's where everything starts. Worldviews are not all the same, and the differences matter a lot. How do you judge a tree? By its fruits. How do you judge a worldview? By its physical, tangible, observable fruit. The things it produces. Ideas that are noble and true produce beauty, abundance, and human flourishing. Poisonous ideas produce ugliness. They destroy and dehumanize. It really is that simple. Welcome to Ideas Have Consequences, the podcast of Disciple Nations Alliance, where we prepare followers of Christ to better understand the true ideas that lead to human flourishing while fighting against poisonous ideas that destroy nations. Join us, and prepare your minds for action!
Ideas Have Consequences
AUTHORITY (10 Words to Heal Our Broken World Series)
This powerful word has been so redefined and repeatedly abused that many Christians shy away at the mention of it. Yet, authority can bring about incredibly positive change when exercised in proper obedience to God's original intentions. In this episode, we delve into the true, biblical meaning of authority, exploring how Jesus entrusts each of us with different forms of it.
We'll challenge the idea that authority is inherently oppressive or self-serving, showing instead how Christ models a selfless, accountable form of leadership. Authority, in its purest form, isn’t about power concentrated in governments or rulers who stray from God’s purposes—it's about serving others with integrity and humility.
Join us as we define and unpack the biblical understanding of authority and discover how, as Christians, we can faithfully live out the roles of authority entrusted to us.
- View the transcript, leave comments, and check out recommended resources on the Episode Landing Page!
- Find out more about the book by Scott David Allen, 10 Words to Heal Our Broken World: Restoring the True Meaning of Our Most Important Words at 10wordsbook.org.
Jesus said I have all authority and I'm giving that to you. So in a sense, he is actually entrusting his authority and his power to us as human beings through his spirit. And you know, when you think about that's dangerous power, but we can wield it because of him, because he never wielded it poorly and wrongly. So, there's this interesting dance. We have a lot more authority and power than we know we have, and it's a good thing.
Speaker 3:Hi friends, this is Scott Allen, president of the Disciple Nations Alliance, and I want to welcome you to another episode of Ideas have Consequences, the podcast of the Disciple Nations Alliance. As we prepare to launch my newest book, 10 Words to Heal Our Broken World Restoring the True Meaning of Our Most Important Words, we wanted to go through each one of these 10 foundational words that are highlighted in the book, discussing their true meaning as well as how they've been fundamentally redefined in our contemporary culture. Now you might be asking why do words matter? Well, it's because words and definitions shape the way we think and feel, and that, in turn, determines our choices and our actions, and that shapes the kind of culture that we live in, for better or for worse. And so if you want to work for a positive change in culture in society, it has to begin by restoring the true meaning of our most important words.
Speaker 4:Hi friends, my name is Luke and welcome to the 141st episode of Ideas have Consequences. And welcome to the 141st episode of Ideas have Consequences and for this mini-series specifically, we are on episode 7 of the 10 Words to Heal Our Broken Worlds series. So thanks for joining us along for this series as we are unpacking the upcoming book 10 Words to Heal Our Broken World. For today's episode, I'm joined by my co-host, dwight Vogt Hi, hey, dwight. And our acting guest for today's show is my dad and the author of the new book, scott Allen. And again, the title of the book is Ten Words to Heal Our Broken World Restoring the True Meanings of Our Most Important Words, and those words are truth, human sex, marriage, freedom, authority, justice, faith, beauty and love. And as we've done with each of these words so far, and you'll hear us do today as we lay them out, you'll hear us lay out the true and the false definitions of this word, the true definition being that which is defined in the Bible, in God's word. And then the false one is usually the most commonly used definition that we hear in many of our cultures today, and yet it's distorted and it's false. And for that reason my dad decided to write this book, and then we'll go on to talk about how each of those definitions creates a culture and what those cultures look like, depending on the definition. And I know for some of us, for myself, when I first heard that statement words create cultures it left a big question mark in my head. But, as you guys heard during the introduction, the way you define a word because often we think in words will shape your thinking, and then your thinking will shape the way you feel oftentimes, and then, of course, that your thinking and your feelings will shape your way you feel oftentimes, and then, of course, that your thinking and your feelings will shape your actions and choices and those in turn will shape the lives that you live and, collectively, the lives that we live in culture. So the words that we use and the way we define them in our minds can shape culture, and that is definitely true with today's word and, uh, that is definitely true with today's word Um.
Speaker 4:I know for myself when I first read through, dad, your list of those 10 words, um and the ones that you chose for this book, obviously you could do a lot more than 10 words. There's been a lot of words that have been redefined from God's original meanings, but you narrowed it down to 10. And this word to me, when I saw it I was like interesting, I wouldn't have expected that one to make it on the list. The words like love, truth, justice, those made total sense, but this one I was just a little bit confused when I saw this one on the list, but the more I thought about it, for me this word and faith probably were the two that I had the most wrong definition in my mind of. I had adopted the false definition much more than I realized. So learning about this one's been super helpful, and I hope it is for everyone listening to this episode today, because it not only is an important word to understand on its own, but it really affects a lot of these other definitions.
Speaker 4:The word we're going to be talking about today is authority, and if you get authority wrong you get a lot of things wrong. I realize it's hard to have the right understanding of marriage as God defines it. It's hard to have the right understanding of freedom, like we talked about last week, as God defines it. So authority really matters God's biblical definition, and, as we hear in a minute, it's been redefined. So, dad, just to get us started today, why don't we just read the two definitions, the biblical one and then the false definition of authority?
Speaker 3:Yeah, thanks, luke. So right out the chute. We're going to give these concise definitions and these are, of course, ones that we developed, I developed, you know. So you know this is my best understanding. So you know, take it with a grain of salt, but here's how I concisely defined true authority it's the power or the right to issue commands, rules, laws and ensure that they're carried out.
Speaker 3:Human authority is delegated from God, who is the supreme authority, and it is accountable to him when properly exercised authority creates conditions in which people thrive. By providing wise leadership in a context of ordered liberty, jesus, as our model for authority, in practice sacrificially serves those under his authority for their good. So again, long, you know, long. There's a lot to this and we'll see, we'll get into that. There's a lot of really, really important facets to this.
Speaker 3:This is a really rich word and concept, but today this word authority has been it's not so much that it's been redefined, it has, but it's the way I would describe it it's been secularized, in other words, in our you know, our secular world in the West, or any. Really it could be actually any culture that denies God Really. It could be actually any culture that denies God, that doesn't know God, the true God, and his son, jesus Christ. They don't know him. So this could be true even of an ancient animistic culture or our modern West, which is post-Christian. So you have a completely different understanding of authority, and here's how I describe that redefined authority. It is an arbitrary, self-serving and often harsh and oppressive use of power and control. It's a concentration of power in a human government or rule that is unaccountable to God, or constitutional limits or the people that are under authority.
Speaker 1:So those are very different concepts. Same word, different ideas. Okay, thanks, scott, wow, yeah, those are especially the first one. I was expecting a few words and it's like a five-sentence definition, so and.
Speaker 3:I also appreciate that doesn't get at it, but yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I also appreciate, scott I think our listeners are observing this that we're starting out with a true definition. You insisted on doing that, and I think that's powerful in itself. Just starting with truth. Instead of starting with chapter 3 of Genesis, we're starting with Genesis 1 and saying here's what's true, here's what's gone wrong. So that's great, but let's go ahead, unpack it, scott. Tell us what are the key aspects of that true definition and just unpack it, for us.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there's just layer upon layer of richness and beauty, and I know that's kind of funny to say because we tend to think of authority negatively. I know I did Question authority and people that have authority or power and those are very closely related words we could get into that should be viewed very suspiciously. So, anyways, but the biblical concept is actually really rich and very beautiful. At its core is you know, the way I start out here is it is power. It's a power or a right to issue commands or rules or laws and to ensure that they're obeyed. I could have said this as well it's a power or a right to punish wrongdoing as well. So authority comes with the power to punish injustice. So that's the core of it. That really is the very center of it.
Speaker 3:The next thing I would say is that authority originates with God himself. He's the supreme authority because he created the heavens and the earth. So all authority, you know, begins with and comes from God and his son Jesus. And that's why, when Jesus was here, you know, right after the resurrection, you know, when he met with his disciples in Galilee, he said all authority in heaven and earth has been given to me. And just let me pause quickly on that word. All that means authority over all okay, over everything. That includes power over the created order. You know, when Jesus was here, he gave orders to the wind and the waves and they were still right. So it's power over that, it's power over all human authority and power over kings and rulers, no matter how powerful they're not as powerful as Jesus. It's power—it's authority over Satan, actually, and so Jesus has power. Satan does nothing outside of God's will or choosing. He has authority over the evil. He has authority over all. So that's so important. You know that authority begins with, comes from God and his son Jesus. You know that authority begins with, comes from God and his son Jesus. Then the next thing to notice is that it's delegated. This God delegates authority and we see this right away in Genesis, chapter 1, where he creates man in his image and he delegates power and authority to him. He says I give you the right to rule, I give you the authority to rule over creation and this delegated authority. There's a humility to this. So, and you even see this in God saying to Adam you name the animals, whatever you name them, I'll call them Just quickly, just to contrast this with fallen. You know, in our fallen world, authority is typically not delegated, it's centralized right. But in God's economy, he delegates authority and he spreads it out and he shares it. There's this humility to that. So human authority comes from God. That's so important to say.
Speaker 3:We as human beings don't have authority in and of ourselves. It all comes from God and it's accountable to God. And God establishes particular types of human authority. Okay, he defines human authority. So he says, fathers, you have authority in your home.
Speaker 3:He defines human authorities and the limits on human authority. So he says, fathers, you have authority in your home. He defines human authorities and the limits on human authority, by the way. So he says, fathers, you have authority in your home, with your children and with your wife too. There is a headship authority there, but it's only in your home and it's only with your wife and your children. That's the limits of it.
Speaker 3:There's authority for the church that belongs to elders. There's authority in the state that belongs to civil authorities. They have the God-given right, if you will, to issue commands, rules, laws and to punish wrongdoing. Teachers have that authority in the classroom, and you could go on as well. There's legitimate human authority, but it all comes from God and it's accountable to God, and we should be looking as well to delegate authority. In other words, we should be following God's example and not seeking to centralize authority in ourselves, but to say how can we share that authority with those under us? So that's the next thing I'd say Then.
Speaker 3:The third thing I would say here is that authority exists and this is really the revolutionary part of it that it exists for the good or the service of those under authority. It is not in any way self-seeking or self-aggrandizing. It exists in order to serve, and you see this most powerfully with Jesus himself. Right, you know, he said you know I didn't come to serve, but to serve and to give my life as a ransom for many, even though he's the supreme authority. He's the supreme authority, and you see this in particular with that famous exchange that happens on the road to Jerusalem, the last trip to Jerusalem that he takes with his disciples, where they're arguing amongst themselves for positions of power in what they imagine will be Christ's worldly kingdom. You know, he's going to kick the Romans out, he's going to establish his kingdom, and they want positions of power. They want to be, you know, the vice president and the secretary of state you know, it's not the—they say we want to sit at your right hand, you know, so to speak.
Speaker 3:And then Jesus says you know, he essentially corrects them and he says you've got this idea of authority in your head, but you've got it wrong. And he says it this way. He says you know the way that the rulers of the world exercise authority, and they're powerful men. I think it's yeah, is it exercise authority or rule over? And in other words, he's saying in this fallen world, you know right, and we all do right. We all know this. Right, we know how authority is exercised. It's exercised to aggrandize and to empower the powerful man or woman at the expense of those under their authority. Right, it's abused. He says you know that. And then he says not so with you.
Speaker 3:This is where he revolutionizes it. He says whoever wants to be first has to be, says whoever wants to be first has to be last. If you want that position of power, you know, if you want greatness in my kingdom, you have to be the last, and if you want to be the great man, you have to be the servant For even the Son of man. Right, the supreme authority didn't come to be served but to serve and give his life as a ransom for many. So Jesus modeled this in this really revolutionary way, this supreme authority laying down his life for us, washing his disciples' feet, and yet, you know, as his disciples said, you know, and the people that heard him, they said he teaches as one who has authority. Right, he had. Clearly, he had this power about him, this authority because he did, you know, and yet he was.
Speaker 3:Again, think about how he exercised it or how it was displayed. When we think of worldly authority, we think of kings and palaces with royal robes and all sorts of people serving on them and groveling. But Jesus, when he came, the supreme authority, was born in a manger, in this little out-of-the-way place, and he was a carpenter. He wasn't, you know, he didn't display power and authority like we would expect in the fallen world. So he revolutionized it in this way that was not proud or arrogant, but humble, and showed us that authority is to be used or exercised for the good of those under authority.
Speaker 3:So, anyways, whenever that kind of authority, biblical, true authority, has been practiced by Christians who are seeking to follow Jesus' example, whether they're Christian fathers or they're bosses in the workplace, or pastors in a church or whatever. It's completely powerful and revolutionary and you guys know that. You guys have served under those kinds of authorities We've had the blessing of having—not everyone has, by the way. In our fallen world, some people have never seen this. They've only seen the false authority. But that's enough for now. That's a lot, but I wanted to just kind of put those big pieces out on the table.
Speaker 4:Now that you've done that, Dad, would you mind just reading that definition one more time for everyone.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so true. Authority is the power or right to issue commands, rules or laws and to ensure that they're carried out and again I could have put here and to punish wrongdoing or injustice. Human authority is delegated from God, the supreme authority. It's accountable to him and, when it's properly exercised, it creates the conditions where people thrive, by providing wise leadership in a context of ordered liberty. Jesus is our model for authority and practice. He sacrificially served those under his authority for their good, and that includes, of course, all of us.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's a hard one because in my mind it's still so cemented in that authority means power and it means lording it over people you know, as Jesus told the disciples and it's so hard to separate that in my mind because it's just, it feels so ingrained, it's just.
Speaker 4:we just need to remember. When it comes to authority, selflessness is absolutely necessary. You cannot have biblical authority if you're selfish. It doesn't work, and to me it's just. We need to take our whole paradigm of authority for a lot of us and flip it completely upside down.
Speaker 3:The first will be last.
Speaker 4:And we say that, but it's really hard to do in your mind even when we you know when these discussions come up.
Speaker 3:It's so true, luke, and I think it's because in the fallen world and this includes the Church, I mean, I have seen the fallen form of authority practiced even in churches or Christian organizations. I hate to say this, but I've seen it practiced more than I have true authority, even in Christian places. So people don't know. I don't think they really know or haven't fully grasped the depth of what genuine authority is, at least not to the level that they're regularly practicing it.
Speaker 4:Hi friends, I want to tell you real quick about how you can get your hands on an early released copy of this book 10 Words to Heal Our Broken World. If you're interested, we would like to invite you to sign up for our book launch team. What is the book launch team, you ask? Well, it's an agreement between us and you, that, number one, we will send you a free, early released copy of this book in October and then, number two, in response, you will read the book and leave us an Amazon review upon its publication date. And if you really want to be a super fan, you can even share the book with a friend.
Speaker 4:To sign up for the book launch team, head to 10wordsbookorg. Again, that is 10wordsbookorg. Spell that either with the number or T-E-N. And, by the way, as an insider tip, don't wait too long to sign up, because there is only 100 spots available on this book launch team. To sum up, the first 100 approved signups will receive an advanced paperback copy of this book by mail, free shipping included. Participants are asked to read the book and prepare a rating and review on Amazon for the release of the book in November. To join, you must be a resident of the United States or Canada and have, and we can only send one book copy per mailing address and one last time. The link is 10wordsbookorg and you can also find that link down in the show notes below.
Speaker 1:I think another thread that's woven in here that you've also touched on, scott, is the thread of what's the purpose of authority, and you've mentioned that. But I think if I think of a good father and a good mother, and they have authority over their children, I say what's the purpose of their authority? Well, it's to keep them safe. It's to keep those kids safe and it's to give them the things they need to grow, but basically it's to ensure that that child become everything that God intends for that child to be.
Speaker 1:So, they will sacrifice their lives to get them to dance studios, to get them to math classes, to get them to whatever event, and they'll sacrifice their time.
Speaker 1:They'll discipline them when it's not pleasant it's not easy to have a child that's against you, but you have to stand. They will sacrifice for the well-being of that child and I think that's almost the most beautiful form of authority that we see as the family parenting authority. But it's true for business A good businessman, for the sake of his company and for this he will help his employees succeed.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, a coach helps his players succeed.
Speaker 1:If they all succeed the team, this, he will help his employees succeed. A coach helps his players succeed. If they all succeed, the team succeeds, he succeeds. So that thread is if you lose that thread, you've lost the reason for authority.
Speaker 3:Totally, dwight, and you're right to carry it all the way to the point of even laying down your life, because that's what Jesus did. You know.
Speaker 3:I mean, he's our example. He is the example because he's the supreme authority, so he shows us what authority in practice looks like. And it goes that far, and you see this in cultures that have been deeply shaped by the Bible. You know, you can think of any number of examples. One that comes to my mind just right now as I'm talking, is the story of the Titanic, right, and here's this ship that's sinking and there's an authority, there's a hierarchy of authority. That word hierarchy is related here to this discussion, but there's a hierarchy of authority on that ship and the captain's at the top of that.
Speaker 3:But because that culture was so shaped by the Bible, he's going to ensure that those under his authority get on those lifeboats first, and particularly the most vulnerable. I think this is another thing, right, the weakest and the most vulnerable are the ones that the authority is most concerned about. This is true authority. He's going to make sure they're protected, they're saved, and then he's going to give his life if necessary. He's going to be the last one. So that's a picture. There's many others, but those are potent pictures of true authority in practice.
Speaker 1:Why do you think that you emphasize, too, that true authority begins with recognizing God's ultimate authority? How is that such a safeguard, or why is that so important? True authority begins with recognizing God's ultimate authority. How is that such a safeguard, or why is that so important? Besides, it's a Christian thing to believe.
Speaker 3:Yeah it's a good question, dwight. I mean it's just such a prevalent theme in the Bible. I mean, you know, there's these major themes and the authority of God is obviously we say things like the lordship of Jesus Christ or we put it in different ways, but the authority of God is just such an important theme in the Bible.
Speaker 3:And I think it's important because, obviously, if authority doesn't reside with God, then it's going to reside somehow on the human plane, right, and we're not going to have any example from God of how we exercise it, and it's going to be exercised in abusive ways, you know, and that's what we see, obviously. So I think it's.
Speaker 1:It's interesting. I was thinking of Isaiah, where Isaiah prophesies the coming of the Messiah and he says one of the things about the Messiah is he will delight in the fear of the Lord, and I'm thinking that's interesting. He will just delight in the authority of the Lord, and I'm thinking that's interesting. He will just delight in the authority of God the massive, overwhelming, unbelievable consuming authority of God. He's going to just wow. That makes him happy. But, he understands the power. Anyway, the delight.
Speaker 3:We sometimes think of and I've mentioned Jesus as our example of authority, and we tend to think well, in the Old Testament you know you're talking about Isaiah God was different. Right, he didn't. He wasn't this humble servant like we see with Jesus. But that's not true. You know, one of the most famous Psalms, psalm 23, really is a picture of God. He's the shepherd here, and the shepherd has authority over the sheep. Right, he's in a position of authority as the shepherd, but it's a picture of how God himself, as the good shepherd, exercises his authority by looking out for the well-being of the sheep, you know, leading them beside water and providing for them and caring for them and even willing to lay down his life for them. You know, this is God himself, this is the heart of God, and David recognized that and he just thrived in that. The Lord is my shepherd. You know, I just delight in that. That God is my shepherd. You know he's this authority in my life, you know.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we talked about freedom last week. That episode came out two weeks ago now. But we're created to be free. We talked about that. God wants us to be free. Humans flourish inside of true biblical freedom. But in order for there to be freedom freedom is the ability to do what you ought there needs to be a structure there the ability to do the good.
Speaker 4:What is the good? There's a structure, there's boundaries, and inside of that there is true freedom. Outside of that it's chaos. So authority's purpose in human structures and government structures, whatever it looks like, is the authority to keep those boundaries. Like for a parent, you're the one that keeps the boundaries for your child and inside of those boundaries your child can flourish and be free. Yes, Um, ultimately, if you get up to the highest levels of human structures, there needs to be something above that in order to keep the boundaries there.
Speaker 4:So, when you're talking about this with someone who's not a Christian. Ultimately you get to that question of who holds the boundaries of this world. Yes, who's going to do that? Yes, who's? The ultimate authority. If there's nothing, like atheists presume, then everything beneath that's chaos, because if there's not something holding it together at the top, then every sphere of authority underneath that, as it goes down the ladder, will fall apart. I'm getting a little philosophical here, but you have to.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you're right, luke, the Bible sets up this, as I mentioned earlier, this concept of authority being shared and delegated and entrusted downward, if you will. In other words, the one that has the supreme authority shares it downward. You know, god shares it with us as image bearers and then he kind of establishes that principle we're to share it downwards in a way that entrusts and holds accountable those under our authority. So, you know, ideally, like, let's say, the civil government in our country, you know the federal government in the United States, they would ideally, if they're practicing genuine biblical authority, they would recognize the spheres of authority below them and they would help them to see—they would desire that those spheres of authority flourish and they would respect those spheres of authority. They would respect, for example, the authority of elders and pastors in their local churches, they would respect the authority of fathers and mothers in the home.
Speaker 3:But instead, in a fallen world, what you see is, you see—you don't see that you see, actually, this fear almost of sharing or delegating authority and this concentration of power I'm going to eliminate. Like you hear right now in the United States, we're going to eliminate the family Because we don't want to share authority with these lower spheres of authority, if you will. In the fallen world it always moves in the direction of authority or power being concentrated, centralized, but biblically it's shared. There's this delegation of authority based on trust and the true exercise of this very powerful concept. I think our founding fathers understood that in this country and that's why they didn't create a centralized federal government. They delegated authority and separated power in all sorts of ways.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, they went over—not overboard, but their understanding of mob—you know I was just listening to Luke and you were saying well, if—you could ask the question. Well, if it's not God who has ultimate authority, who should Well it—you? Know well, should it be you?
Speaker 1:Well, no, no, it shouldn's not God who has ultimate authority. Who should? Well, should it be you? Well, no, no, it shouldn't be me. I'm just a human being. Well, should it be the mob? Well, no, I don't want the mob to be my authority, and I think our founders looked at both and said they will fail. The mob fails. So we can't have pure democracy in the sense of no minority representation, and we certainly don't want individual rule that gives us tyranny and dictators.
Speaker 1:You know, so you have to. You would invent a god if if you didn't have. You know, I think that would be there's people would invent god if he didn't exist you know, because oh yeah but just the fact that, yeah, we need a, a divine, pure, wise, ultimate authority over us, and that's God.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. And you know we haven't got on to the cultural. You know the way that this word, when it's truly understood, creates culture, but it's so powerful actually.
Speaker 1:Well, that's your cues. Go for it, Scott. How does that create culture?
Speaker 3:Well, I'd love to hear your guys' thoughts on this too. Dwight the good or the bad.
Speaker 3:Especially thinking of our experience with Food for the Hungry because this concept of authority being shared and delegated and used for the good of those under authority, it is so uncommon in the world today. It is so uncommon, you know, in the world today. But where it's understood and practiced, you know, it really does become very, really revolutionary. Some people are bothered, for example, about slavery in the New Testament. Why didn't God just outlaw slavery? And he didn't actually, you know, this is not something that he outlawed in the New Testament, saying slavery is now illegal.
Speaker 3:But here's what he did and in some ways it's even more powerful. He changed our understanding of authority. So he said masters that have slaves, you have to change the way you understand your position of authority as a master and you have to see, first of all, you have to see your slave as not some inhuman you know, dehumanized person, but you have to see them as a fellow human being created by God with all the dignity and all the worth that you have. You're equal in that respect and you actually have to serve them for their good.
Speaker 3:Okay, that completely upends the institution of slavery and that's exactly what Paul did in his letter to Onesimus, and so slavery then essentially over time just becomes abolished. So it's very interesting God didn't again outlaw slavery, but he did redefine authority in a way that just totally revolutionized that institution. And you see this over and over again. You know, I think, of places where we've served a way—in the developing world. You see a lot of abuse of authority in tribal kind of contexts. Or you see this in Asia. I remember in churches that I served at in Japan there was a lot of abuse of authority in tribal kind of contexts. Or you see this in Asia. I remember in churches that I served at in Japan there was a lot of abuse of authority. But where it's understood and practiced it's one of the most powerful things for the flourishing of that, the development and the flourishing of that community that you can do, I would say, in some ways.
Speaker 3:Yeah it's interesting.
Speaker 1:I know we're not here to talk about that, but I do remember some situations where, yeah, it's like I remember going into a context where there was very much direct control in this culture. And then to come in, as an American, I could do no less than to say well, the ultimate person here is the one that's working closest to the poor, closest to the most vulnerable child, and let's put as much decision-making into their hands and the resources they need because, ultimately, that's where the rubber meets the road, and it's not about us.
Speaker 1:It's about them doing the best job possible, because they're the ones that are actually working with that poor widow and that poor child. But it was revolutionizing that we would try to give power and control and resources to focus that far down the ladder yes to a group that was directly involved with the people they were serving we don't practice this well, even in the church, we just don't.
Speaker 3:But when you do, you see it, like you said, dwight, there it becomes really powerful it becomes revolutionary. Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Anyway, it was fun. It was fun, yeah, it was exciting.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think of a church that I or I visited Haiti several years ago and I was, you know, trying to understand. You know, there's such brokenness in that country and there's a church there and I was trying to understand. What is it that is wrong? Why is it the church having more influence on shaping that culture? And one of the things that I heard that really grieved me and this isn't true just of Haiti, this is true all over the world but that pastors were reluctant to disciple their congregation because if they were discipled, they would gain knowledge and practice and then they might become a threat to their power. So they literally didn't disciple and I thought, well, that's a huge problem here. Okay, if they're worried about hanging on to their position of authority and not willing to delegate it, and they don't understand authority as service for those under authority, you're not going to have a healthy church. If you're not going to have a healthy church, you're not going to have a healthy society. So I just remember being really struck by that.
Speaker 1:I think it's easy to talk and say yes, we should all have this view of authority. But the other complication is that authority is usually tied to power over resources, over salaries.
Speaker 3:Yes.
Speaker 1:And it usually generates a degree of wealth and comfort and privilege. And so there's this constant. I was thinking what if we paid presidents the lowest in the company, you know? Would they really aspire to be the president? No, they wouldn't. But there is this conflict? Because with authority usually comes privilege.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's correct. And here's the irony of that, dwight, is, then you get these really bad people in authority, right? You get these corrupt politicians or whatever it is, because that's what they want. They want the power, right.
Speaker 1:And we see pastors that are fighting not to lose control, because ultimately that's what they'll lose is privilege and a salary, potentially.
Speaker 3:And it's true of all of is privilege and a salary?
Speaker 1:potentially yes, and it's true of all of us. We all have that.
Speaker 3:Really good point there at the end. Dwight, you know this word, authority is something that we all have, positions of authority, so it's not us pointing fingers at, oh, those bad politicians or those bad people in authority over there. This is the application aspect of this is you have to ask yourself what positions of authority do you have and how do you view it? Is it some kind of a prerogative for you to kind of be comfortable, as you were saying, or feel good about yourself, enrich yourself, exercise your authority over others, boss them around so that you're not bossed around, or whatever? What's your attitude about that authority, and is it true or is it false?
Speaker 3:If it's true, then it's a position of responsibility to serve those under your authority for their good, even to the point of you sacrificing your life, if necessary, for them. So, if you're married, if necessary for them, so. But if you're married, if you're a teacher, if you're an elder, whatever it is, if you're a parent, whatever that sphere of authority is, how are you exercising it? Because it has to start with you, right? It's not just saying, oh, these guys over there, right, they? They're abusing authority. How? The questions always how are you? This is a very applicable word.
Speaker 1:Scott, maybe this is putting you on the spot, but how have you thought through meekness in this definition of authority? Because meekness is another tribute or trait of Christ. He was meek.
Speaker 3:Yes, Well. I think I'm going to turn that around to Luke, because I know you've you've done some thinking about this, luke, this question of meekness and power. Yeah, how do you, how do you understand that?
Speaker 4:no, no, you're putting me on the spot sorry yeah, I love the word meek. Um. Uh, blessed are the meek. Um. Put simply, I think that the best definition I've heard of meekness is power under control. So it's the right use of power. I think of Gandalf. When I think of meekness in Lord of the Rings, I think of the wizard who has the ability to zap the bad guys, but instead he controls it and he's a background figure. He's Gandalf the Grey for most of the time.
Speaker 4:And he just walks around helping people out. And, yeah, meekness I think of again your definition, I think, brings in meekness really well, in the sense of it needs to be selfless, and that's where it comes in. That's the power under control, because authority without meekness is you think of superiority, you think of lording it over. With meekness is that ability to say okay, yes, I do have power, that's part of my authority, but I'm going to wield it very carefully. Yes or even not exercise it or maybe don't, and when?
Speaker 3:I do it's only for the good of those I'm serving but, but, but it's so important which you said, that look, you have the power right, you could do it, I mean so there's there's this kind of um contradict, not a contradiction, but it's hard for us to get our heads around because it's real power, but it's clothed in humility and self-control.
Speaker 4:I think of. Well, and the thing is, you have to understand we're all in places of authority, but we have to understand that people thrive under authority, when it's exercised right.
Speaker 4:We have to know that if we're in authority, we have to know that if I don't do my responsibility that God's given me here, then I am hurting those that I'm supposed to be serving because they thrive under it. It's a human default. We love to be under good authority. I think of when I was a kid if I didn't have a parent that was looking out for me and exercising the first sentence here of your definition, that is, the power and rights to issue commands, rules, laws and ensure that they are carried out. You know, if we just read that sentence without selflessness in the picture, we think rules, yuck, commands ugh laws whoa.
Speaker 4:Enforcing. Oh, my goodness, this doesn't sound Christian at all, right? Aren't we just supposed to love? But it's no. We need those, the boundaries. Yeah, and as a kid, if I didn't have a loving parent that was enforcing rules, commands and laws, then I'd sit on the couch, watch TV every day and eat sugar and eventually I would realize, okay, this isn't working for me. And we see that with kids all the time. That just don't have good authority in their life and they go and they search for it right.
Speaker 4:They go and join the high school football team because they need that authority structure or the neighborhood gang or whatever it is right. Or neighborhood gang. A lot of kids who grew up in broken households do really well in the military because they need they, they desire that structure and they flourish under it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh yeah, because they need, they desire that structure and they flourish under it. Yeah, oh yeah, that's a really good example Luke. Yeah.
Speaker 4:Yeah so again if you're not exercising your authority, well then you're actually hurting people. And if we don't grasp that responsibility and, you know, seek to do it, well then it's not that we're just missing out on an opportunity, but we're actually hurting the people that we're supposed to be, or you know whatever we are in authority over.
Speaker 1:So if this is all the true definition of, authority and we love it. And we say go for it, let's do it. Why are we in love with the false definition, or why do we trend towards it, or what's?
Speaker 3:Well, I think, why do we go? The think I mean? Simply, dwight, our fallen heart is selfish, right, you know, it's, it's, it's inclination is self-serving, you know, and not other serving. So true authority is, by its very nature, other serving, other focused. It's focused on the good of others. Um, but that's not our natural condition in this fallen world we're selfish. Am I missing anything there, dwight?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean. The problem is we're selfish to the core. Even when we think we're not being selfish. We've probably got some selfishness going on. But yeah, I'm just thinking, you know how do we fix the world and authority and and it's to cure selfishness, you know that's right.
Speaker 3:Why don't we get into the false authority?
Speaker 3:because this is this is real, as you said, luke, at the beginning. This is what most people understand. This is the world that we live in. This is our experience, for the most part is living under this false authority, which is the way I define it arbitrary, self-serving, harsh, often harsh and oppressive use of power, control, concentration of power or rule that's unaccountable to God or any kind of constitutional limit or the people under authority. It's not looking out for their good at all. I think for a lot of people, this is how they understand authority, and rightly so, because this is real. This false authority is very often the authority that people see and experience in this fallen world.
Speaker 3:I think where it becomes really destructive is that, if this is all it is, if all the goodness that we've talked about is stripped out of authority and it's just power and control for selfish, you know ends, you know it becomes an entirely negative concept.
Speaker 3:First of all, True authority is very positive because it leads to flourishing and thriving, but negative authority is entirely negative and you get this kind of strange thing where people I think of that again, Lord of the Rings, but that famous line from Gollum in Lord of the Rings, you know he was this negative authority is the ring of power in Lord of the Rings, right.
Speaker 3:It's this power to control, to dominate, right, and Gollum was so attracted to that power, but he also loathed it and despised it, and so you see both of those in false authority Like this is a very negative concept. We view it very negatively because whoever's got it's going to abuse it at my expense. But then I need it. It's like I absolutely need it because if I don't have it, somebody else is going to. You know, somebody's going to gore me, right? You know I've got to be the one in the position to gore you and not have you gore me, you know, if you will. So that's the world that we live in, that's the way that we tend to think about authority in this fallen world, and again for good reason. We've all experienced the pain of being under abusive authority, right? It's very real Thoughts from you guys on that.
Speaker 1:I could almost hear Gollum in your voice, scott, thank you. I hate it, but I need it, I need it, oh, I want it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, you just need it, I need it, oh, I want it. Yeah, yeah, you just crave it. You know it's like it becomes the highest good, you know, in some ways, or the highest thing that you want.
Speaker 1:I'm listening to you and I'm just thinking yeah, and the more power you have, the more control you have. And the more control you have, the more controlled life is, and if it continues on to its zenith, you get, I guess, the Antichrist and everybody else under complete control. I mean, it leads to control and this sense of I can't breathe, I can't be me, there's no liberty.
Speaker 3:There's no freedom.
Speaker 1:I just can't breathe, and what an awful world to live in, to think of. You know, if you're thinking about authority and you're going well, let's not worry about it. No, let's worry about authority, because bad authority leads to control, where everybody can't breathe.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 3:I think you know, back to the church again, and you know this word, submit is related. Submit is, you know, is related to the concept of authority, because submit means to submit to a rightful authority to willingly obey, you know, those commands that the rightful authority gives. And that's seen entirely negatively. And you, you know, you especially see this. You know, around discussions of Christian weddings, right, you know, women say I don't want to be in a position of submission. You know that's very negative and they've got a point there because they've seen or experienced, you know, the abuse of authority in the home and so, but again, what's the solution to that? It's not to perpetuate these false things, but it's to recognize the good thing, the true thing, the true authority, the true power, and to live that out. And that includes being willing to submit to true or genuine authority and actually being very glad to. You know, the Bible speaks positively of submission as well and we're all in positions of submission because we're all under authority at the same time that we have authority. You know so.
Speaker 1:My default on that one is that if there's tension in that relationship, it's because somebody's not using authority rightly. Correct, correct If there's an abuse of authority, it will be difficult to submit. I submitted to my parents because they were wonderful authorities.
Speaker 3:They really were. It wasn't hard to submit. Yeah, you had that really.
Speaker 1:you had a really strong example in your family, Dwight, If you've got good authority, it's pretty easy to submit because you know they're for your flourishing. But again, a lot of people.
Speaker 3:I'm mindful that a lot of people have never seen that, Dwight, and just how much of a gift that is that you had that example of real authority in your home. And just there's a whole lot of people who've virtually never seen that, which always just boggles my mind, but I'm thinking of a soccer team Scott where there's one person that's called to be the goalie.
Speaker 1:They're supposed to submit to the ball coming to them and the other one's supposed to kick the ball and kick it into the other end zone's goal, and they're constantly looking at each other and criticizing each other for not doing their part. You're not submitting Well, you're not actually attacking the goal correctly, and the Bible says no, you worry about your role. So, my message to men and women today is stay in your lane, play your role and don't try to control your spouse's job.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and you're using that example in marriage. It could be in any role of authority and submission.
Speaker 1:So many times we look at our spouse and say well, you should be this way because this is what the Bible says, or our boss or whatever it is. You worry about your role.
Speaker 3:Correct and I think that's the right way to do it, dwight is what is the true biblical role here, of authority or submission? Let's redeem it, let's do our best to understand it and to live it out. You know that really honors God. You know he's very pleased with that and let's do that. You know, not that there's a time that we don't, you know, have to confront, uh, abuse of authority. There is right, you know, in the home or otherwise. But, um, but you know, I think you're right to say let's focus on, you know, ourselves, our own lives and our own roles. Are we, you know, in a role of authority? How do we carry that out biblically in a true way?
Speaker 1:And without denying that there's a command submit. Submit to one another in love, Submit to those in authority Submit to God we're called to submit. Honor your parents, honor your father and mother. I think this authority and submission, I think in the Bible, I think this authority and submission.
Speaker 3:I think in the Bible we're not encouraged to make those markers of our identity, but rather they're to be kind of hats, if you will, roles that you play and you put them on and you take them off, but it doesn't shape who. You are right, you know what I'm saying. Yes, there are certain times when I have that role of authority, there's times when I have that role of submission. Often I have them both simultaneously, depending on the context. But it doesn't define me, whereas I think in the fallen world it moves in the opposite direction. In the fallen world these kind of tend to become markers of identity. I am, you know, this powerful authority or whatever it is that defines me, you know, and I think the Bible always kind of pushes back against that and says, no, that doesn't define you. That's a role that you can play, that you will play at different times, and you need to play it correctly.
Speaker 4:I'm trying to keep up with you guys. This is a lot of good stuff here. And it's again, it's so counter, just the way my brain thinks, but it's like I'm trying to think of examples, I'm trying to you know um cause it's yeah, it's so hard. I mean the beginning of your definition, again on the biblical side is the power or right to issue commands.
Speaker 4:You start out with power and we always think of the word power and we think of the. You know the catchphrase power corrupts Absolute power corrupts absolutely. And power is bad. You know Synonyms for authority, oftentimes for people, are going to be abusive power stepping on people, authority authoritarian stepping on people, um, authority, authoritarian, right, uh, and so it's just so twisted. Yeah, I'm having such a hard time, just even during this discussion, pulling myself away from that and remembering that we need to flip that upside down and think of it selflessly yeah, go ahead oh, scott, I'm going to challenge you, maybe.
Speaker 3:What's the?
Speaker 1:role of the elections. We're having an election here in the United States in November, and elections are about putting people in authority and power great power and great authority, both in the Senate and the House and everywhere. What is your message to the church in terms of how to vote in light of biblical authority? Yeah, because it's all there We've got—anyway.
Speaker 4:And you've got 30 seconds, you've got 30 seconds.
Speaker 1:Well, I have another thought.
Speaker 3:Well, I've got a couple thoughts on that, dwight. I mean one is that in our system of government, which I do think was heavily shaped by kind of biblical ideas, and here you see that our system of government, this constitutional form of republic, republican form of government, it vested the power—this is very interesting— it vested the power, ultimate power, in the people themselves. And this is really—the United States was the first country to do this. Up to that point, it was always vested in a king, it was top-down. The United States says we're going to turn that around and we're going to be bottom-up, we're going to vest—and the Constitution starts with those famous words we, the people, right, I mean we are the rulers, so to speak. Okay, and so then we select people to. You know, we delegate authority to them, but it's a delegated authority from us in order to carry out these roles of leadership and creating order. But they're accountable and they are accountable to us.
Speaker 3:So what does that mean for churches? I'm scandalized, quite frankly, dwight, by the fact that in the United States, I think it's something like 30% of evangelical Christians don't vote. They don't vote. So what that means is that when we have a president or senators, or whatever it is that we dislike, they're pro-choice, they're doing all sorts of abusive things, harmful things. We really have to say we're to blame, okay, we're to blame. In other words, if even half of that 30% voted and voted biblical values of upholding the dignity of human beings and life and things like that, if even half of them did, we would have different outcomes in these elections.
Speaker 3:So we often say in church I hear this very often oh, we're so grateful for the freedom to worship as we want. And at the same time, you hear this very same people often say, oh, I don't want to get involved in politics. Well, I'm saying that freedom came from politics, that came from being people actively engaging in the political sphere. It didn't just drop from heaven, you know, and it came because of decisions that people made, and it can go away as well. So, again, I just want to urge people in this country, in our country, any country that vests power in the people, you don't point to someone else and say, oh, you've got to exercise authority correctly. That's our job. We are vested with authority in this country and we've got to, you know, at a minimum. The bare minimum is vote right, okay. So that's my little rant on that encouraging people to vote. Did you have another point?
Speaker 4:Yeah, I think we can get confused with voting too, and you know all the policies and the you know. You can get just so deep into all of that. But, as Christians, you know vote on your principles, vote on your values. We say that a lot. Okay what does that mean? That means that you know we're releasing this book soon on 10 words to heal our broken world. They can heal a broken world.
Speaker 4:Look at the definitions of the people you're voting into positions of authority hold it's usually pretty easy too, by the way, to figure out what people believe about these words. It comes out in their speech, it comes out in the way they act and the decisions they make, so you know what's their view of authority.
Speaker 4:You can figure that out pretty quick by listening to a politician talk, and if they're promoting a biblical view of authority, most likely they won't, but maybe they will. That'd be great. That's a good sign. What's their view on love? What's their view on love? What's their view on marriage? What's their view on freedom, or even?
Speaker 3:more powerfully. You know people, politicians especially, can say the right things, but Jesus' advice is really helpful here. You'll know them by their fruit. So look at their track record. And I would say, look at their track record in terms of just two things. You can look at a lot of things, but number one when they have authority, do they tend to centralize it? Is that their kind of default? We want to centralize power, or do they want to share and humbly, you know, delegate power to states, to families? I mean, is that the direction they're moving in?
Speaker 3:Okay, I would choose the person who's going to delegate power, right, as opposed to the person who's going to centralize power, and you can see that from a track record. And then, are they using that power and authority to serve, especially the weakest and the most vulnerable? And you see this on the issue of abortion, right? The weakest and the most vulnerable are the unborn in our country. So how are they using that? Are they using it to destroy or are they using it to sacrificially serve? What's their track record? They'll say whatever, but what's their track record on those things?
Speaker 4:It's deceptive too, because they'll often say the Bible answers. That's right, because we live in a nation that's so uh, so encultured by Bible, that, um, we all love to hear things that sound biblical. You know, you know, I'm for love and we're like oh, love's biblical.
Speaker 3:I love it.
Speaker 4:You know Great Uh. So that is confusing. If you just listen to what people say and you don't look at their fruit, oftentimes they'll sound, honestly, pretty Christian in the way that they promote themselves, at least in the US.
Speaker 3:But yeah, look at the track record. You've got to look a little deeper than that. Yeah, were you going to say something, dwayne?
Speaker 1:Oh, I think that was a great summary. You could say that two or three times. I think it's so clear. I would add one more and that is an authority that looks down the road and sees danger ahead and even though we don't see it yet, that person does and says I'm going to start working with that danger because somebody's got a bit of a long range vision.
Speaker 3:Yeah, true leadership in that respect.
Speaker 1:It's just interesting. Look at our current political situation and both are really complaining about the other one's authority. One says if you elect that person, you will get a. All the authority will be, you know, in that one person.
Speaker 3:Yeah, authoritarian is the word that people use a lot.
Speaker 1:Authoritarianism and the other. Then you know that candidate fights back and says no, but if you elect that person, then the party is going to control you and the state's going to control you. And so they're both saying there and the state's going to control you. And so they're both saying there's an abusive power coming, don't elect them. Elect me.
Speaker 3:That's right. Yeah, that's right yeah.
Speaker 1:Somebody just present a positive picture of authority and power and I'll probably vote for you. You know, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:But anyway, yeah, no, I think that this warning of authoritarianism you know you can't, you know. Again, it's because people see authority entirely negatively. But then again, if they have the power, they know too that that's how they'll exercise it. And they just can't. They just can't, you know, they can't allow someone else to have that power. It's the ring of power. Again. You know and Luke, this gets to you were asking about power. You know, power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Speaker 3:Lord Acton, or whoever said that, you know that famous quote, and I do think that's true in a fallen world, and this is where we need God, you know, to have that ultimate authority. God is the only one who's powerful enough to hold the ring, if you will, and he delegates it to us, and we understand that it's a delegated authority. It's a delegated power and we're accountable for how we use that. We're going to exercise it in a completely different way, you know so. Lord Acton was correct. In a fallen world, let's say, but in a biblical framework, when we understand that our authority and power is delegated and we're accountable to God, he's going to hold us to account for how we exercise it. You know it's going to be exercised in a different way.
Speaker 3:I think again, lord of the Rings sorry, we keep coming back to that, but remember there's that famous scene with Gandalf right, where you know he's being offered at the beginning, the ring right. Frodo says here, you take it. And he says no, you know, I would try to use this authority, this power, for good, but I can't even wield this right. You know I'm not powerful enough to wield this, you know through me.
Speaker 4:It would do incredible evil. Yeah, I think of the Old Testament kings, right, and you saw a lot of them take the ring and they wanted the power and authority and things would fall apart quick.
Speaker 4:And then you saw other kings and they took in a way they grasped the authority and they immediately handed it back to God and they tore down the high places and the idols and stuff. Authority and they immediately handed it back to God and they tore down the high places and the idols and stuff and they went into like a time of mourning and fasting and giving up the evil and accepting the authority, but giving it to God and saying God, how can you use this authority through me? And that's just a good picture of when we get authority. It's not something to shy away from, but it's something to submit to God and say use this in me properly, or else it will devolve into power and power corrupting power.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's right, yeah, we've been talking a lot about we live in a fallen world and we're basically selfish and that's why the world looks at authority and says it's bad and power is bad, that's right.
Speaker 1:But you just reminded me that Jesus said you know I have all authority and I'm giving that to you. So in a sense he is actually entrusting his authority and his power to us as human beings through his spirit. And you know, when you think about that's dangerous power. But we can wield it because of him. That's right, because he never wielded it poorly and wrongly.
Speaker 1:So there's this interesting dance that he's. Not only is he raising his children to let us free at 18, he's saying no, you're going to actually have my spirit. It's amazing. We have a lot more authority and power than we know we have, and it's a good thing.
Speaker 3:To exercise it wisely and truly is probably one of the most transforming things we can do. We talk about the power of truth to transform culture, whether that culture is our family or our city or our nation. Exercising authority truly is one of the most powerful things. I mean all of these words have the power, when they're exercised correctly, to bring about positive change. This one really does. I mean it really does.
Speaker 1:It looks like courage and leadership and sacrifice, sacrifice, laying down your life for the good of others.
Speaker 3:Yep, absolutely, it's amazing, it's amazing.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we need to start wrapping up for today, but I mean, we've been talking about this for five minutes now. But as some final takeaway points, how can we, as Christians, recover this true definition and live it out in our lives? You gave a couple examples there. Do we have any more before we wrap up?
Speaker 3:Well, I think you were right, luke. You know, I think we're all so deeply shaped by the fallen world understanding of authority and that's true for Christians as well that we haven't even fully seen. You know what this looks like truly. And I think it's really important to start with that. Just start by really deeply reflecting on what this is, what the true definition of it is and how it's been modeled, especially by Jesus. I mean, he really is the one that we want to look to here as our model for this. And then you seek to say how.
Speaker 3:The next question is how can I demonstrate that kind of authority the way he did in my positions of authority? What needs to change? How does that need to change? Both my attitude and my practice change? How does that need to change both my attitude and my practice? So I just, yeah, again, I would like to, I have to do this. I have to do this all the time because and again, this isn't something you do just once we all have that fallen heart, right, I mean, I'm constantly challenged right to kind of just, in a little way, use those positions. And I do sometimes, you know, for my own benefit, you know. So I do sometimes you know, for my own benefit, you know. So where do you need to change? I mean, that's the question we have to ask, and you know, and again, maybe some motivation here will be yeah, you will be held to account. God will. It's a delegated thing and he will hold you to account. Think about the day you're going to stand before him and give an answer. That might motivate you a little bit.
Speaker 1:The fear of God. Thank you, Scott.
Speaker 3:That's called the fear of God. That's why it's a bit of a big deal actually.
Speaker 1:You know, we delight in the fear of the Lord. There we go. All right, let's delight in that.
Speaker 3:We need that. What about you guys? What thoughts do you have on that kind of practical application? Okay, none good. Well, no, no, no, sky you said it well, thank you, I'm not gonna add to that.
Speaker 4:That's a good wrap, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, that is a good wrap and, um yeah, that was a really fun discussion. Thanks, guys um really helpful.
Speaker 4:I hope this was helpful for everyone listening as well. And um, yeah, like we said earlier, this word affects a couple of the other words in this list. It might affect all of them really. Um, but uh, this word is really important to remember that we all have authority and it's so easy to point at other authority structures that we don't like and tell them to fix, fix up their you know, get their act together, get their act together exactly. But we have to remember, at the same time, we also have positions of authority and we should start with ourselves and try to live it out. The biblical definition of authority in our own lives, in our own realms of authority, whatever that is, even if it's just authority over your cat. Yeah, so we can all do that. No, it's true.
Speaker 3:Yeah, cats are in the news right now, but actually.
Speaker 3:I think just to add one quick thought, because I think your point's really good there, luke. You know there's a lot in the Bible and the New Testament on elders in the church and that position of authority in the church, which is really an important position. Dwight, you're an elder in your church right now and it's a really important one. There's a lot of qualifications and they tend to have to do with have you practiced authority in the smaller sphere faithfully? If you have, then you can be entrusted to have this position of authority in greater things, and I think that's a very important biblical message. So, just like you're saying, you know, start with that most basic level, yeah, the authority that you have, maybe over your own pets right, if you're a kid extra, start there, you know, and then you can learn what authority is and then you can exercise it correctly in larger spheres of influence or responsibility. You know, all the way up.
Speaker 4:So no, yeah, yeah, that's great, yeah, so yeah, guys, as we continue in this series, we have a couple episodes left, but we're getting close to the book launch date. Ten Words to Heal Our Broken World will be out on November 19th, so we're excited to bring that to you. In the meantime, if you want to learn all things 10 Words to Heal Our Broken World head to 10wordsbookorg. You can spell that T-E-N or the number 10, 10wordsbookorg. On that page you can find all things 10 words, uh. Right at the top of the page. Right now we have a join our launch team section that you'll see when you head to the page. If you want to join the launch team, the? Uh. There's only 100 spots on that launch team and they are filling out fast, so uh, don't want to rush you there too much, but I would suggest getting over there pretty quick and uh filling out the sign up form. All you guys need to do is just give us your email and your name, um, and then uh. Unfortunately, for this, you have to be a resident of the U? S or Canada in order to do this, but, um, what you get to be on the launch team is you will get a free copy of the book an early released free copy of the book and in return, we will just ask you to give a Amazon review when the book comes out. Other reviews would be great as well, as on Goodreads or wherever you get your books. But that Amazon review will help us a lot in getting this book out to more people. So we would encourage you to sign up for the launch team. Again, those spots are filling up fast, so go over there, sign up today.
Speaker 4:10wordsbookorg. We also have coming out with this book, a study guide which we're excited to share with you guys. That is going to be based off a video series that my dad put together, a video series where he goes through each one of these words in about 10 minute videos and lays out, like we did today, in a much more concise manner, of the true definition, the false definitions and the lives and cultures that those will produce. And then there's going to be the study guide that goes with that, and if you'd like to take your small group through that or your church through that, you can also find that on 10wordsbookorg. It's not out yet, but it will be about the time of the release of the book, so November 19th is that date. Keep that in mind.
Speaker 4:And, in the meantime, yeah, you can get your free copy if you join the launch team and yeah, we'll continue to bring these episodes to you guys. I hope that you are sharing these with your friends and helping us spread the message. We really appreciate that. In the meantime, if you would like to help support this podcast, the easiest way that you can do that is by heading to the podcast app that you're currently using and just giving this show a rating and review. We always appreciate those, and those really help us just continue to grow the show and bring on awesome guests, as we do every once in a while. So we'd encourage you to do that. And yeah, for today, that's it. Dad Dwight, thank you for your time. Really enjoyed it, been fun.
Speaker 3:Great to be with you, Luke.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and to our listeners. Thanks again for listening to another episode of Ideas have Consequences. This is the podcast of the Disciple Nations Alliance.